I own my own home, what is the best way to protect my house if we were to separate down the track? would a trust work? will talk to a lawyer next week, thanks in advance.

kiwiangels - 2020-11-18 12:14:00

Family trust. Just more insane and unbalanced laws to avoid.

pcle - 2020-11-18 12:16:00

a pre nuptial agreement , trusts have more of a grey area , and choose the wording very carefully.. seeing your lawyer is totally the best option for you to seek your advice.. smart move

daz1968 - 2020-11-18 12:26:00

daz1968 wrote:

a pre nuptial agreement , trusts have more of a grey area , and choose the wording very carefully.. seeing your lawyer is totally the best option for you to seek your advice.. smart move

And think of how to address scenario's which could be problematic over a longer period of time, if there maybe children from the relationship, etc. Just like many other 'contracts', the longer it is from the setting it up to it being enforced, the more likely that there will be areas of contestment.

brouser3 - 2020-11-18 12:52:00

kiwiangels wrote:

I own my own home, what is the best way to protect my house if we were to separate down the track? would a trust work? will talk to a lawyer next week, thanks in advance.

firstly you don't live in it as the family home if you can. Get a comprehensive s21 agreement drawn up that covers everything, dont be stingy on the cost of that. Get done well before 2.5 years is up. If he won't sign it, you terminate the relationship. Don't let partner spend any of theirtime or money on it, charge them a weekly rent and share living expenses but not property expenses. You have to be hard if you truly want to protect your house. A trust will no longer protect you so that's a waste of time.

gabbysnana - 2020-11-18 13:15:00

gabbysnana wrote:

firstly you don't live in it as the family home if you can. Get a comprehensive s21 agreement drawn up that covers everything, dont be stingy on the cost of that. Get done well before 2.5 years is up. If he won't sign it, you terminate the relationship. Don't let partner spend any of theirtime or money on it, charge them a weekly rent and share living expenses but not property expenses. You have to be hard if you truly want to protect your house. A trust will no longer protect you so that's a waste of time.

Thank you will look into it, not living together yet but will be moving into my home, no kids together, my will states house to go to my only child, want to protect that for him as you never know down the line, partner is happy to sign anything.

kiwiangels - 2020-11-18 14:04:00

I would go to ghe lawyer and probably set up a trust for him. I dont think your will can do anygood if u die first and the partner has the prperty. It will not workout. The only full proof way is to seperate some for him now as in ownership. Yes lawyer is the go and what is he or she contributing to the relationship ?. Good luck.

msigg - 2020-11-18 14:30:00

kiwiangels wrote:

Thank you will look into it, not living together yet but will be moving into my home, no kids together, my will states house to go to my only child, want to protect that for him as you never know down the line, partner is happy to sign anything.

Your will will offer no protection. See a lawyer. In short though, a contracting out agreement and a properly administrated trust.

johnston - 2020-11-18 14:41:00

My lawyers advice to me was exactly as #5 said, get a really good lawyer to protect your asset because you never know what might happen after 3 years of the 2 of you living in YOUR house.

articferrit - 2020-11-18 15:00:00

kiwiangels wrote:

I own my own home, what is the best way to protect my house if we were to separate down the track? would a trust work? .

A trust? I think actual trust. Already you think this way which doesn't bode well.

lythande1 - 2020-11-18 16:26:00

lythande1 wrote:

A trust? I think actual trust. Already you think this way which doesn't bode well.

It’s all very well saying trust the person assuming that’s what you mean, but would you take a bet $500k on the fact that your relationship would last. That’s what it would cost me to buy out a partner of my house, which is fully paid off so would be going way backwards and couldn’t probably even get a mortgage to cover that at my age on my own.

I call it sensible, nothing is 100%. Partnerships do break up, people do turn nasty etc

christin - 2020-11-18 17:15:00

If there is no debt on your home get the lawyer to maybe put the home in shares with your child. The other options are you live somewhere else and put the home in equal shares with your child or you carry on status quote and each of you live in separate homes and go away for holidays etc together. Or you can get a pre nup done and he gets nothing. If he doesn't sign you know exactly where you stand. If there is debt on your home that is a whole different ball game.

strathview - 2020-11-18 17:16:00

christin wrote:

It’s all very well saying trust the person assuming that’s what you mean, but would you take a bet $500k on the fact that your relationship would last. That’s what it would cost me to buy out a partner of my house, which is fully paid off so would be going way backwards and couldn’t probably even get a mortgage to cover that at my age on my own.

I call it sensible, nothing is 100%. Partnerships do break up, people do turn nasty etc

Absolutely.

johnston - 2020-11-18 17:57:00

Its simple you must get partner to sign a contract that states they can never get any part of your house as well as other relationship property(relationship property agreement)the lawyer will word it properly.
Trusts aren't as bullet proof as what some think.

210sback - 2020-11-18 18:00:00

210sback wrote:

Its simple you must get partner to sign a contract that states they can never get any part of your house as well as other relationship property(relationship property agreement)the lawyer will word it properly.
Trusts aren't as bullet proof as what some think.

Each party has to seek separate legal advice from separate lawyers. It's the only legal way. You both want to Opt Out of the Relationship Property Act. My husband and I did this when we first started living together. Not only are you protecting your assets, he is also protecting HIS assets!

Good luck with your new partner! :D

Edited by hazelnut2 at 6:09 pm, Wed 18 Nov

hazelnut2 - 2020-11-18 18:08:00

hazelnut2 wrote:

Each party has to seek separate legal advice from separate lawyers. It's the only legal way. You both want to Opt Out of the Relationship Property Act. My husband and I did this when we first started living together. Not only are you protecting your assets, he is also protecting HIS assets!

Good luck with your new partner! :D

that is assuming a couple has assets when they get together....the only thing my husband and I had were our clothes and our computers so if we did split after 3 years we would just take our own computers and clothes ....he did buy the bed but none of us had a car or even any furniture.

basically all our assets we have acquired since being together. we did discuss doing a prenup but figured since we both had nothing (such as a house) when we entered into our relationship there wasn't much point

cathi - 2020-11-18 18:24:00

johnston wrote:

Your will will offer no protection. See a lawyer. In short though, a contracting out agreement and a properly administrated trust.

Do as above. Totally correct.

carstauranga001 - 2020-11-18 19:26:00

Consider the value of your kiwisaver.

keys - 2020-11-19 10:43:00

lythande1 wrote:

A trust? I think actual trust. Already you think this way which doesn't bode well.

Moving in with someone is already the start of a legal contract. Best get advice and sew it up legally, preferably with multiple layers of protection which are costly to attempt legal attacks on.

sweetgurl108 - 2020-11-19 16:37:00

carstauranga001 wrote:

Do as above. Totally correct.

except the trust bit.

gabbysnana - 2020-11-19 20:21:00

Stay single.

comsolve - 2020-11-19 21:24:00

This message was deleted.

vintage_betty - 2020-11-20 06:40:00

gabbysnana wrote:

except the trust bit.

Properly administrated trusts still have their place.

johnston - 2020-11-20 06:49:00

johnston wrote:

Properly administrated trusts still have their place.

not for this reason, you should be aware of this and why.

gabbysnana - 2020-11-20 08:09:00

gabbysnana wrote:

not for this reason, you should be aware of this and why.

I disagree and while trusts are frequently challenged each claim must be assessed on its facts. Not foolproof but still worth considering in conjunction with other arrangements.

johnston - 2020-11-20 08:14:00

comsolve wrote:

Stay single.

or together but live apart.

serf407 - 2020-11-20 08:25:00

serf407 wrote:

or together but live apart.

Not always sufficient

nic48 - 2020-11-20 13:57:00

prenup and discuss it before they move in and get wheels in motion. Always sooooooooooo much harder when they living with you, every one feels awlful, BUT if you discuss it before they move in and get the agreement underway there will never be a problem

sheryl13 - 2020-11-20 14:15:00

Never be a problem. Don't you believe it.

johnston - 2020-11-20 15:17:00

serf407 wrote:

or together but live apart.

That was my thinking to avoid spending thousands on a pre nup.

Edited by cassina1 at 5:20 pm, Fri 20 Nov

cassina1 - 2020-11-20 17:19:00

cassina1 wrote:

That was my thinking to avoid spending thousands on a pre nup.

There we have it. More bad info from Cassina1
Each partner will "invest" about $1500 to protect their assets. If you have nothing then $1500 is a waste of money. For the others it's a small investment to make.

carstauranga001 - 2020-11-20 19:42:00

Know of two couples that have decided not to move in together. Each couple spend a lot of time together but each keep their own homes. Reason being is the wealth that they have accumulated is for their children and their children only. During war time the family home was never left to the surviving spouse, it was left to the children so they had a home to grown up in. This happened to my MIL.

strathview - 2020-11-20 20:29:00

nic48 wrote:

Not always sufficient

True e.g the Moon and Doyle case.
https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/national/man-awarded-300-0
00-by-courts-after-partner-left-him-nothing-but-her-ashes/

serf407 - 2020-11-20 20:37:00

carstauranga001 wrote:

There we have it. More bad info from Cassina1
Each partner will "invest" about $1500 to protect their assets. If you have nothing then $1500 is a waste of money. For the others it's a small investment to make.

And who said romance was dead?

Edited by sparkychap at 9:06 pm, Fri 20 Nov

sparkychap - 2020-11-20 21:06:00

Contracting out agreement done by solicitor is the way to go. We did one and have just sold the house. I got back the money we'd agreed on when we did the contracting out agreement.

susieq31 - 2020-11-21 14:40:00

susieq31 wrote:

Contracting out agreement done by solicitor is the way to go. We did one and have just sold the house. I got back the money we'd agreed on when we did the contracting out agreement.

\
Family friend did the same many years ago. She had $90k capital gain from a previous property that went over and above their equal deposit on the new property. They split, she got $90k+ half what was left.

sw20 - 2020-11-21 14:56:00

The member deleted this message.

carstauranga001 - 2020-11-21 15:53:00

sparkychap wrote:

And who said romance was dead?

LOL, feeling like stirring mate? Romance and Reality... If a relationship can't have both, don't have the relationship.

carstauranga001 - 2020-11-21 15:53:00

carstauranga001 wrote:

LOL, feeling like stirring mate? Romance and Reality... If a relationship can't have both, don't have the relationship.

Ha ha, that was directed at cassinova. not you, sorry!

sparkychap - 2020-11-21 16:05:00

Mate up with someone richer than you are.

masturbidder - 2020-11-21 16:08:00

strathview wrote:

Know of two couples that have decided not to move in together. Each couple spend a lot of time together but each keep their own homes. Reason being is the wealth that they have accumulated is for their children and their children only. During war time the family home was never left to the surviving spouse, it was left to the children so they had a home to grown up in. This happened to my MIL.

It seems to be a grey area of what is and what isn't a 'relationship' - even in the world of legalese. I believe that individually maintaining and having separate residences is not enough in itself to protect one against a claim from the other. Perhaps they are just 'friends with benefits'.

Edited by brouser3 at 5:41 pm, Sat 21 Nov

brouser3 - 2020-11-21 17:40:00

sw20 wrote:

\
Family friend did the same many years ago. She had $90k capital gain from a previous property that went over and above their equal deposit on the new property. They split, she got $90k+ half what was left.

So she didn't get the value of her initial contribution because I am sure that $90K was a far greater proportion of the property value than when it was sold. She should have had wiser legal counsel who would of advised to proportionise so that capital gain, inflation etc was also accounted for before the 'split' was done.

brouser3 - 2020-11-21 17:46:00

brouser3 wrote:

It seems to be a grey area of what is and what isn't a 'relationship' - even in the world of legalese. I believe that individually maintaining and having separate residences is not enough in itself to protect one against a claim from the other. Perhaps they are just 'friends with benefits'.

Better go and talk with a lawyer. I was gobsmacked when I spoke with a lawyer and found out what I could and couldn't do. Needless to say I consider that the best money I have ever spent. Just a little annoyed that I never got legal advise before I got married. Made some changes that may shock someone.

strathview - 2020-11-21 18:32:00

brouser3 wrote:

So she didn't get the value of her initial contribution because I am sure that $90K was a far greater proportion of the property value than when it was sold. She should have had wiser legal counsel who would of advised to proportionise so that capital gain, inflation etc was also accounted for before the 'split' was done.

How do you what legal advice she got and what her wishes were?

johnston - 2020-11-21 18:33:00

johnston wrote:

How do you what legal advice she got and what her wishes were?

I don't - but would only assume that she would of wanted to protect the 'value' of her contribution, if things went pear shaped.

brouser3 - 2020-11-21 22:35:00

brouser3 wrote:

I don't - but would only assume that she would of wanted to protect the 'value' of her contribution, if things went pear shaped.

Why would you possibly think a lawyer would not agree?

johnston - 2020-11-22 09:06:00

brouser3 wrote:

I don't - but would only assume that she would of wanted to protect the 'value' of her contribution, if things went pear shaped.

Was the 'value of contribution' including interest payments on the principal payments, insurance & rates payments, maintenance & any upgrades?

Those costs are a cost of having the property & cannot be avoided, unless it's only the real value of the property taken into account.
Next thing their lawyer will be saying is " oh & in that time you didn't have to pay any rent, so we will take that value out of your half" Eddie.

marte - 2020-11-22 16:47:00

kiwiangels wrote:

I own my own home, what is the best way to protect my house if we were to separate down the track? would a trust work? will talk to a lawyer next week, thanks in advance.

Contracting out agreement

sarahb5 - 2020-11-28 14:41:00