Deceased estate, No Will, Letter of Administration
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| 1 | Hi, Long story short, a relative died in a car accident, aged 35 had no will, not married, no partner, no children. but had a $250,000 life insurance policy, BUT there are no beneficiaries listed on the policy. It was a compulsory work related policy for which they didn’t even pay the premiums. The mother is obtaining a Letter of Administration… but here’s the fly in the ointment. The relative has never known or even met the father who lives permanently overseas and has had virtually no contact, it is fair to say the father has “ The End of the World is Nigh ” issues, and the 4-5 emails over 35 years have been sporadic and the contents bordering on bizzaire, including the father seriously doubting he is even the father. Even though the accident was over 2 years ago the father probably doesn’t even know of the death, nor to be honest would he be that interested, being that the world is going to end soon anyways.. Under NZ law if there is no will, no partner, no children etc then the next in line beneficiaries are the parents. But given the total exclusion of the father from the persons life, how does the mother prevent him from gaining 50% of the policy ? The family is going to see a lawyer, but the circumstances are unique so any general information to help her progress the Letter of Administration would be appreciated. keytag - 2019-07-24 19:23:00 |
| 2 | I think the only advice is legal advice from a reputable lawyer carbs51 - 2019-07-24 19:30:00 |
| 3 | carbs51 wrote: I agree... the problem is the 99% of disreputable lawyers give the 1% reputable lawyers a bad name... :-) :-) I think the family want to be on first or second base during the discussions such that they don't get hoodwinked or confused or shunted in a direction that makes it worse. I'd go so far as to say the family would consider not even getting a Letter of Administration if the father was to be an uncontestable 50% beneficiary. Chances are if it was to go on to be extensively contested they could spend $50k+ to ultimately achieve very little. keytag - 2019-07-24 19:39:00 |
| 4 | The mother needs to consult a lawyer who has knowledge with estate administration. Furthermore, harsh as it may seem, legal fees can be horrendously expensive and litigation can drag on and on so she needs to be aware of that. If this is the total of the estate - it isn't actually that much in todays environment and it could get eaten up pretty quickly. brouser3 - 2019-07-24 19:40:00 |
| 5 | brouser... 100% agree with everything you said... we have had previous business experience where a young lawyer for a large law firm and clearly on a weekly earnings target went around and around in circles and chewed through $30k with zero results, except that we changed lawyers and got a result for $8k. keytag - 2019-07-24 19:52:00 |
| 6 | Contact your local Citizens Advice Bureau or Community Law Centre for assistance. ironthrone990 - 2019-07-24 23:35:00 |
| 7 | It may be best to be honest about the father, who he is, where he is and leave this in the hands of a solicitor you trust. Don't make the mistake of going down the litigation road, it rarely works out for anyone. Just be grateful there is some money coming, don't hold probate up by being sneaky. We don't live in a fair world, unfairness is everywhere, money is great to have but it can really muck things up for people who like it too much. jhan - 2019-07-24 23:42:00 |
| 8 | jhan wrote:
Spot on!! h28skipper - 2019-07-25 14:07:00 |
| 9 | I have seen ads in local newspapers asking for any relatives of XxxXx to contact ZZZZ, solicitor or executor. If you believe the father is in NZ, that’s where the ads will be placed. cosimo - 2019-07-25 14:49:00 |
| 10 | jhan wrote: rotorbladz - 2019-07-25 15:16:00 |
| 11 | I don't know but I think unless the father is proven not to be the father he will be entitle to half. He should have to pay back pay for child support for 16 years to the government if they got a benefit for that time. The higher the wage he earned the more if he was on a benefit maybe not much. I have known none to be paid to the family then the father gets back to new Zealand has been a very high wage earner and back pay of above there benefit and back pay from when the mother worked was paid. Edited by ash4561 at 3:38 pm, Thu 25 Jul ash4561 - 2019-07-25 15:32:00 |
| 12 | I'd go so far as to say the family would consider not even getting a Letter of Administration if the father was to be an uncontestable 50% beneficiary. They have to get administration for anything over $15000 Edited by ash4561 at 3:35 pm, Thu 25 Jul ash4561 - 2019-07-25 15:34:00 |
| 13 | 'how does the mother prevent him from gaining 50% of the policy ?' - how can she know or prove the wishes of the deceased? amasser - 2019-07-25 17:04:00 |
| 14 | Thank you all for your comments..... The father is overseas and has been the entire 35 years... He is " off grid " prepping... over ...and over..... and over again (yawn) for the end of the world... no one has initiated contact with him for 5-10+ years, every 5 or so years someone might get a short random ranting email, but no one ever replies, all emails are permanently deleted, no one has any contact information and the rare time I have Googled his full name nothing comes up. No one wants anything, ever, to do with him. keytag - 2019-07-25 19:02:00 |
| 15 | There is one possible twist.. We do not have a copy of the policy, the insurance company says we can apply for a copy after filing a claim and after filling in numerous forms and affidavits, but the forms require the naming of the father, which could be the opening of the can of worms, hence some reluctance to go there. The thinking is more along the lines that the policy is solely between the insured, the company and the beneficiary, and if all 3 ducks line up (quack-quack-quack) then the non named beneficiary (the father) becomes a lame duck and irrespective of his point of view, the claim is settled, without him even knowing, with the mother and it becomes signed, settled, sealed and delivered over a nice cuppa tea ? Or as they say in the Mitre 10 ad... " Mate... ya dreamin..." ? Edited by keytag at 7:26 pm, Thu 25 Jul keytag - 2019-07-25 19:19:00 |
| 16 | At the moment I am waiting for some inheritance money from my Step Grandmother from the Netherlands, I had to go to a Notary Public which is a title given by the Archbishop of Canterbury in England to have everything I provided signed by the Notary Public and had to provide my full birth certificate to prove my mother is my mother, my parents marriage certificate, we had to get a Paternity Check on my mother through NZBDM to prove she had no other children that we did not know about (proved there were no other and we knew that), my full home address including telephone number and the special code for bank account for the money for the Notary Public in the Netherlands and right now it is sitting with the Netherlands Tax Department to find out what if any Tax is to be paid on this inheritance. It's been a headache and one I and my 2 sisters will be glad when it is over There is a chance that the Father may have to prove his paternity of the lady which is why it is very important there is a Lawyer who knows everything about Inheritances and what is required before any money is released Good luck in getting the result you wish for crab2 - 2019-07-25 20:35:00 |
| 17 | Is the father named on the deceased's birth certificate?? mousiemousie - 2019-07-27 14:20:00 |
| 18 | Is the father named on any documentation including a birth certificate or taxation type documents? If not everyone knows nothing. It will have to be notified in NZ newspapers and then everyone just has to wait and everyone keeps quiet. If he is named there is little that can be done and he may be entitled to half of the estate whether Mother likes it or not. Yes he might have to jump through some hoops eg paternity The fact he might have some issues doesn't enter into it. Just because some family have little contact doesn't mean there are not others in the family that keep in close contact. Be very careful. Lawyers can smell money if there is a hint of an issue so play it very cool. I know of an estate where the people the estate was meant to go to have passed away. The estate is now being handled by a lawyer and the funds which are considerable are being split between numerous cousins. Quite a little windfall for all of them. strathview - 2019-07-27 18:27:00 |
| 19 | Money being the root of all evil. neon2k - 2019-07-27 19:10:00 |
| 20 | timed out ugh. Even the govt forms are not totally up to date - latest amendments not included. Not likely to hide a parent that is written/ recorded on an official NZ birth & death certificates - wllgtn high court will see those Have low expectations of anything. Edited by serf407 at 11:34 pm, Sat 27 Jul serf407 - 2019-07-27 23:33:00 |
| 21 | neon2k wrote:
The love of money is the root of all evil. emeargg - 2019-07-28 07:58:00 |
| 22 | Thank you for your comments. The only asset of the estate is the $200k insurance policy. NZ Guardian trust advises the following: " A small estate has no property or assets worth more than $15,000, such as in cash, shares, KiwiSaver, bonds or managed funds. If so then the next of kin can manage the administration and distribution of the estate themselves..." "if the estate has assets worth more than $15,000, such as in cash, shares, KiwiSaver, bonds or managed funds) or has property, someone needs to apply to the Court to be the administrator of the estate..." Question 1: Is the $200k Life Policy considered an asset of the estate ? Question 2: If the $200k Life Policy has the mother, and only the mother listed as the sole beneficiary, is it still considered an asset of the estate, or does it slam dunk belong to the mother, and therefore no other person has any valid claim against the policy ? keytag - 2019-07-31 17:56:00 |
| 23 | When my husband died he had two policies. One was in my name - ie I got the benefit of it within a short time after his death - it had nothing to do with his estate. The other policy was a workplace one and was paid out to his estate and distributed according to his will. Based on my (obviuosly limited)experience then, I would say: cinderellagowns - 2019-07-31 18:29:00 |
| 24 | Thanks Cinderella, some great information. keytag - 2019-07-31 18:44:00 |
