| 201 | The member deleted this message. mals69 - 2021-01-09 07:21:00 |
| 202 | The member deleted this message. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 10:14:00 |
| 203 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 10:19:00 |
| 204 | mals69 wrote:
Everybody renting a property is needy, (if can't afford to buy a house today) where would they live if they we're not renting off private landlords or the government ? Cars, vans and shantytowns. The only reason we don't have the last is WiNZ packing motels full of homeless. kestrel43 - 2021-01-09 10:26:00 |
| 205 | gunna-1 wrote:
I know china will retaliate, you cant make an omelet without cracking some eggs, imagine going back to making clothes, shoes, electronics and countless others again, those tech jobs are for certain groups of people, certainly not everybody..
Making clothes and shoes? We will still have to import the materials, and the lowers. Electronics? All of the components would be imported, so it would be assembly only. The cost of all of these goods would probably go up in price considerably. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 10:27:00 |
| 206 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 10:34:00 |
| 207 | gunna-1 wrote:
They will, but at the moment its being made by people not being payed properly in china remember, it creates real jobs, I.T wizardry is not for the masses.
Will they offset the many thousands of jobs we will lose in primary industries? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 10:45:00 |
| 208 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 10:48:00 |
| 209 | gunna-1 wrote:
Selling pine to china? they can sell it here, and forestry workers can take up some carpentry.
Really? You do realise you will only be selling into a market of five million people ay? That's not going to do anything to boost export receipts, of which we will already have lost a third due to China. How will we pay for the materials we need to import to make the shoes, clothes and electronics? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 10:55:00 |
| 210 | The member deleted this message. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 10:58:00 |
| 211 | gunna-1 wrote:
Import some of our primary industry stuff to some bloody body elce, import the cotton from india. Why can't we do that now? Perhaps China is buying the stuff from us now, because they are the ones who need it? We will also need a supplier of moulded soles for our shoes, synthetics for the uppers, laces, glues, threads, and I don't want to get started on the electronics.
We seem to be putting a whole lot of people through universities, usually in not so useful stuff like BA's. Perhaps we could encourage more intelligent people into fields like research, sciences, design and programming? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:08:00 |
| 212 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 11:10:00 |
| 213 | gunna-1 wrote:
Get the rare earth from russia.
For what? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:15:00 |
| 214 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 11:16:00 |
| 215 | gunna-1 wrote:
Electronics.
And they will cost a hundred times the cost of just importing the components from overseas. Do you understand how difficult and expensive it is to make IC's? And the enormous amount of R&D required? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:20:00 |
| 216 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 11:24:00 |
| 217 | gunna-1 wrote:
Then we go back to makeing quality electronics and service shops, not biffing stuff out every five years, and have you thought about the possibility for time consuming labour intensive stuff to be done by people living rent free in houses for workers provided by the govt, like the old railway houses.
So you suggest we spend billions of dollars investing in factories to make electronics components and chips (that we could buy cheap from China), and the resulting electronics would be so expensive that Kiwis couldn't afford them anyway. I gather you have never worked in manufacturing or industry, it's not as simple as you seem to think. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:30:00 |
| 218 | apollo11 wrote:
...We seem to be putting a whole lot of people through universities, usually in not so useful stuff like BA's. Perhaps we could encourage more intelligent people into fields like research, sciences, design and programming? Actually we seem to be giving free fees to a whole lot of failing students. Thanks taxpayers. "Of the fees-free students, a quarter of them failed at least one course for both 2018 and 2019, 16.2 per cent withdrew from at least one course in 2019 compared to 15.8 per cent in 2018, and 35.1 per cent of them did not complete at least one course for both years. But the figures jump for 2018 fees-free students who continued to second-year tertiary study: 28.2 per cent failed at least one course, 22.8 per cent withdrew at least one course, and 42 per cent did not complete at least one course." Herald 8 Jan, paywalled. artemis - 2021-01-09 11:32:00 |
| 219 | apollo11 wrote:
So you suggest we spend billions of dollars investing in factories to make electronics components and chips (that we could buy cheap from China), and the resulting electronics would be so expensive that Kiwis couldn't afford them anyway. I gather you have never worked in manufacturing or industry, it's not as simple as you seem to think. Plus there is the little matter of the 2008 free trade agreement between New Zealand and China. I'm sure China will turn a blind eye to breaches. artemis - 2021-01-09 11:35:00 |
| 220 | artemis wrote:
Actually we seem to be giving free fees to a whole lot of failing students. Thanks taxpayers.
.
Yep. Government handouts working as you'd expect. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:37:00 |
| 221 | artemis wrote:
Plus there is the little matter of the 2008 free trade agreement between New Zealand and China. I'm sure China will turn a blind eye to breaches.
Look at what China is doing to Aussie. We are even less important to them. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:38:00 |
| 222 | The member deleted this message. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 11:47:00 |
| 223 | gunna-1 wrote:
Someone should, we do have some millionaires in the country, and probably more fleeing america at the moment, why not, they can build some dwellings for workers and make an amendment to the min wage laws so they can pay them alot less while being accommodated for free...
Communism could use someone with your thinking abilities, gunna. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:52:00 |
| 224 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 11:53:00 |
| 225 | gunna-1 wrote:
A degree of socialism in a free capital market, get it right.
How can it be 'free capital' when you have just suggested we make the millionaires pay to set up factories? How can it be a market when we are giving houses away for free? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 11:59:00 |
| 226 | The member deleted this message. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:05:00 |
| 227 | gunna-1 wrote:
Who said anything about makeing them, just askeing, if you dont ask you dont get, plus they might think we would make it tough for them, but i think its a worth wile venture if we can get people onboard to invest in something like this, the free houses are for the workers, a degree of socialism in a capitalist society.
Because they won't do it voluntarily. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:08:00 |
| 228 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:09:00 |
| 229 | gunna-1 wrote:
Why the hell not?.
Because it's billions of dollars down the tube? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:11:00 |
| 230 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:16:00 |
| 231 | gunna-1 wrote:
Realy? why did china invest in it.
Because they are a country of over a billion people, little in the way of environmental laws and they had the last twenty years of stealing IP from the US I guess. Plus they have the natural resources.
Edit: And even now they aren't able to produce anything under 14 nanometers, they rely on the US, which has cut them off. Edited by apollo11 at 12:22 pm, Sat 9 Jan apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:20:00 |
| 232 | gunna-1 wrote:
Someone should, we do have some millionaires in the country, and probably more fleeing america at the moment, why not, they can build some dwellings for workers and make an amendment to the min wage laws so they can pay them alot less while being accommodated for free... Not that hard to be a millionaire these days. Maybe that 'Someone' could set up crowdfunding so those with good equity in their homes and with retirement savings could voluntarily contribute to build factories and houses. Any takers? gunna-1, that 'Someone' could be you. artemis - 2021-01-09 12:26:00 |
| 233 | artemis wrote:
Not that hard to be a millionaire these days. Maybe that 'Someone' could set up crowdfunding so those with good equity in their homes and with retirement savings could voluntarily contribute to build factories and houses. Any takers? gunna-1, that 'Someone' could be you.
Gunna likes socialism. You must always help yourself to other people's money. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:32:00 |
| 234 | The member deleted this message. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:36:00 |
| 235 | gunna-1 wrote:
Asking people to invest is not holding a gun to there head, and countries have flourished this way, right now people are being murded everywhere and is isnt me calling for it, oh and scrap the police unions.
People would say no. Because it is financial suicide. Would you spend billions on factories to supply a population of five million? (You wouldn't be competitive overseas, because you'd be competing with China). apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:39:00 |
| 236 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:40:00 |
| 237 | gunna-1 wrote:
Well china is on the rocks atm with aussie, they could be a good customer.
Would they be willing to pay a thousand bucks for a radio? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:43:00 |
| 238 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 12:45:00 |
| 239 | gunna-1 wrote:
Realy? why did china invest in it.
Remember that it took China twenty years of luring foreign companies to invest in their cheap labour and lax environmental laws by building factories. China didn't get there by themselves. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:47:00 |
| 240 | gunna-1 wrote:
Thats why you need to house the workers and pay them a lower wage, a smart investment from the beginning, better quality, and not made in china.
You have just paid a billion dollars for a chip etching fab. How many chips do you have to sell just to pay the interest on the capital invested? apollo11 - 2021-01-09 12:50:00 |
| 241 | I've been trolling you a bit, sorry gunna. But you did say that NZ doesn't have the quality of people who can program, design and research. And then suggested we build an industry that would require thousands of highly intelligent and educated people.
And 'more socialism' never solves any problems.
Your friendly Globalist elite dearly want the world to be socialist. There would be no more need for democratic elections. The proletariat would all be guaranteed 'equality of outcome' ie, an equal share of poverty, and the globalists would have the wealth of the world for themselves.
I believe it would be the end of what freedoms we have. Edited by apollo11 at 1:27 pm, Sat 9 Jan apollo11 - 2021-01-09 13:26:00 |
| 242 | gunna-1 wrote:
I know china will retaliate, you cant make an omelet without cracking some eggs, imagine going back to making clothes, shoes, electronics and countless others again, those tech jobs are for certain groups of people, certainly not everybody..
Those people who make things are called 'workers'.
They get paid 'money' which they use to buy other things, and pay for services like 'rent'.
If they accumulate 'money' they can employ other 'workers' in a 'business' and make more.
The money goes round and round, called 'circulation'.
That is how it works. And to quote Lenin "He who does not work shall not eat" which is one communist principle we should apply more widely. |
| 243 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 16:00:00 |
| 244 | gunna-1 wrote:
Who the hell is lenin He's a pre-internet socialism enthusiast. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 16:28:00 |
| 245 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 16:29:00 |
| 246 | gunna-1 wrote:
Who john lenin? i hate the Beatles.
No the other one, who killed millions. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 16:35:00 |
| 247 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 16:38:00 |
| 248 | Sounds like the story that gets dragged out whenever a beer is opened. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 16:39:00 |
| 249 | This message was deleted. gunna-1 - 2021-01-09 16:41:00 |
| 250 | gunna-1 wrote:
I dont drink anymore, but they had unsworn officers running around and i,me still looking for them, people are being tight lipped about it in our so called democracy.
As far as I'm aware, you can be a non-sworn police employee, but an officer has to be sworn. apollo11 - 2021-01-09 16:43:00 |
